Re: Politics, bashing, flaming, and baiting

[Timaaay!]

NO bashing of any kind, from either side.
Also, please, no cussing, and, asterisks. Thanks.
Bill Cahill

Well that certainly takes all the fun out of it! Just kidding, Bill.

Just one question to clarify: Does that relate only to other users or to anyone, such as a public figure? If I were to say "Some dope on Meet the press said......." would that be OK?
If it were more specific to a person, such as "Cheney's defense of torture is idiotic." or "Nancy Pelosi's idea of no forceful interrogation is stupid." Or would it have to be a personal attack, such as "Representative X is complete moron."
I'm not trying to nit-pick or be funny here. Just establishing the boundaries so I don't cross them.

[Bill Cahill]

Actually, it covers about everything.
The problem is if you are quoting a negative, someone could be inflamed, and, start a firewar.
Thanks for asking.
Bill Cahill

[Ron Pond]

Me and my wife are very liberal, and a few other forums, have really lashed out rather angrily at democrats and especially liberals because of our ideals, and I think that's wrong on a site dedicated to radio talk. Some of the finest people we know are liberals, and have done so much to help others by reaching outside themselves and their myopic little world, to give help to those who both need and appreciate it. Conservatives are great people too, we just don't know any of them!

Show me forums that lash out at liberals and I'll show you an equal number of forums that lash out at conservatives.

[sprman]

Icame here for radios not politics.However things go this is called a radio forum.Sprman

[bobwilson1977]

Me and my wife are very liberal, and a few other forums, have really lashed out rather angrily at democrats and especially liberals because of our ideals, and I think that's wrong on a site dedicated to radio talk

Both " sides" do it. I'm on a couple of what I'd consider pretty conservative forums. Mostly about cars and trucks and those kinds of things. The bulk of those on it HATE with a capital "H" anything remotely liberal or related to Obama. They use terms like " Socialist!" a lot and some of the pictures they post of Obama are sometimes actually a bit troubling.

But... I remember also being on a lot of pretty liberal forums too: Mostly political and news web sites- and the language and attitude towards Bush was equally nasty and bad. That and the comments about conservatives were sometimes outright mean and hateful.

I was thinking the other day that forums, blogs, and the internet in general are still recent tools in regards to politics. If you think about it, nobody had really even heard of the term "blogging" in the 2004 election. In 2000, the internet was still new. But now that it has become a common practice for people to use as a way to voice their opinions and do so anonymously, you get to see the raw underbelly of America, and truthfully its a bit troubling.

I would hope that the next step forward is for both sides to start talking to each other. It obviously does nothing to rail and flail against people who don't agree with you. It would be much better to find common ground and go from there.

[Tarpawns]

I guess I have my own selfish reasons for keeping Politics off Radio Forums. I haven't seen one Radio Forum that endorses this policy actually really grow in membership. That regrettably might be the fate of this Forum. Not a statement just an observation. Now some of these Forums have some very talented knowledgeable people. On one site there's a discussion that's being going on about a political commercial since last October. Now I have my own beliefs but just like those religious guys that come a knocking on my door you ain't going to convert me no matter what you say. I send them on their way politely. Politically I usually share those ideas with like minded individuals but spare my neighbours, friends and relatives who might not share those same thoughts. To me it's just common sense. The informality of the internet only amplifies it. I've seen some of those so called adult cordial discussions on other Radio Forums that might of been settled in another way in real life than just the verbal tongue lashing. And it ain't exactly a nice setup to encourage new members to post such questions. In theory you could limit that to a "Clubhouse" but in reality that confrontation spills into other Forums. It's the nature of the beast.

As i stated when I started out I have my own selfish reasons. Politics isn't limited by any borders. On one particular thread on ARF a somewhat arrogant and ignorant comment was directed at Canada. With our troops dieing in Afghanistan on a weekly basis, ( I have relatives in that fight) those misinformed comments like that aren't exactly appreciated. At least seven members joined in and endorsed the original comment before the thread was correctly locked by Curt Reed hardly a left leaning liberal. Another comment on another thread suggested we join a group with Iranians and Cubans and board a flight and fly to Libya. Not funny and not called for in my eyes.

As for Moderators on ARF there are two members from Alan Voorhees own state that are openly right wing Conservative. Alan seems to have to picked a mixture when it comes to moderators and for the most part it just works.

By the number of posts and frequency and membership I would suggest that the policy adopted by ARF works. My best to the Moderators here.

Best Regards

Ken.

[Resistance is Futile]

I'm going to let the poll run longer just to see, as its getting close to being evenly split.

[Timaaay!]

I find peoples belief and reasoning quite interesting, as long as it's not presented in a harsh way. Just the way that I find troubleshooting a radio, understanding the "why" fascinates me. So-called political sites rarely afford one an opportunity to truly understand the reasoning behind someones opinions.
Case in point- I understand that folks on the left (as stated here too) seem to complain that the people on the right attack too much. My question to that is: 95+% of attacks from main stream television seems to be quite the opposite. Daily attacks by Letterman, Bill Mahr, Jeannine Garaffolo, Joy Behar, and on and on. Can you name one single talk show host or regular TV personality that attacks the left? I could name, literally, more than 50 Hollywood stars (off the top of my head) that do this on a regular basis. Can you name even a few stars that attack the left? The vast majority of media is left leaning, the vast majority of teachers and professors are quite left leaning.
That doesn't bother me, but just an observation. What does bother me is downright hate speech. Jeannine Garofolo, Sean Penn, Al Franken, etc. don't just state their views, they are mean, hateful, intolerant people that should be scorned, but I hear no outrage. MSNBC is THE most hate-filled, mean-spirited, shocking media outlet I've ever seen, with not even a distant second place contender. Rush Limabaugh is also a hateful guy, but we hear about it and he is chastised (rightfully so) for his behavior.
This is but one question that I would love to hear comments from folks and tell me where I'm going wrong with my observations. No yelling, no name calling, but an honest assessment of a different point of view.

[Ron Pond]

I'm going to let the poll run longer just to see, as its getting close to being evenly split.

Are you going to wait until the no votes outnumber the yes votes and then close the poll? You seemed reluctant to keep the poll open while the yes vote prevailed. What has changed your mind, the swing towards the no vote, as I suspect?

This poll should have been conducted within a preset time frame to make it fair to all. How ridiculous would it be if your country or mine conducted general election polls without a set time period in mind?

Ron.

[bobwilson1977]

Well, as I mentioned earlier, I think both sides "attack" the other in equal proportions. Sure- the left attacks the right and do so from media outlets that could potentially be labeled as left-leaning. But there are other media outlets that are heavily right-leaning such as FOX news. All you have to do is go onto their site and check out the blogs. 99% of the posts are from pretty right-leaning people making pretty nasty comments about liberals. I'd consider CNN to be a pretty liberal-leaning network for none other than their CEO, Ted Turner is an outspoken liberal who has gotten into trouble for making comments like: "Jesus Freaks" and so on.

I think the Right has strong control of the AM waves. It makes a lot of sense: A lot of conservatives live in rural areas and listen to AM radio. Rush Limbaugh is HUGE. People also believe what he says. He is a big influence on how his followers think.

The bottom line is that these media companies are in it for the money. FOX is smart by positioning themselves as the news outlet of choice for conservatives. Most Conservatives I know are vehemently loyal to them. The same with CNN and more liberal networks. It is very lucrative because in doing so, it makes it easy for marketers to more accurately pinpoint their target audiences. That way a company like John Deere can advertise on an appropriate network. Wouldn't make sense to sell tractors to liberals would it?

But at the end of the day, the media is made to form opinion and maintain loyalty. Its sad that so many people rely on other people's opinions for their own. I think this is a major reason why ideology has become so divided. These networks manufacture opinion and strengthen beliefs artificially.

Time for people to get out and think for themselves.

[Resistance is Futile]

Nothing unfair, I guess I am doing what pollsters do best.


Time is allowed so people can see how others vote, a lot of the most vocal are doing the most postings, and this allows those that don't frequent as often, a chance to weigh in.

Take a deep breath, count to 5, exhale, and continue to watch the tally. Who's on first?

[tpaairman]

Here's one from our board owner:

http://tuberadio.heavenforum.com/the-clubhouse-f1/al-gore-his-green-t104.htm

And from ARF when he was telling that he had opened this board:

Lets hope you are not right... I don't care if folks vent their anger/opinions whatever... as long as it does not get vulgar, stabbing, racial or discriminative it should be ok... If one speaks their mind and gets flames for a reason... It's a different story... I will try to leave the thread open with a warning, and lock it if it gets out of hand... No disappearing posts

I am confident my moderators will do an exemplary job as they are good folk...

Robert

Ps, BDM, I couldn't agree more with you about the catlin thing...

Here is what i am trying to get across here... I will have the forum moderated, But not smothering or over-moded... It is my first anything on computer... I hope more of you guys will come... How do you think it should be conducted... Opnions are needed,

Thanks
Robert

The point is, Robert has established rules, but he was trying to make it so that you don't have a mod breathing down your neck on every post, ready to pounce. And yet we have thread like the pirate standoff thread where there was some political discussion, but not over the top. People just voicing an opinion. And what happened? Bill jumps in a calls it a flame war, and locks the thread.

The problem as I see it, is the mods are trying to apply all of Alan's rules here. Everyone says that we should be posting radio items as it's a radio forum. But the clubhouse is for NON RADIO postings. I think as long as there isn't cussing, racism, etc, that everyone needs to grow up, realize that you are big boys and girls (old enough to hold a hot soldering iron for God's sake) and relax.

[Doug K.]

This all sounds kind of like the way our government is being run now, everyone in charge interprets the constitution to fit his/her needs....or wants.

[Resistance is Futile]

Take a look at where most of the postings are.
Good grief!!!
Is this a Radio Forum or Not?

There are postings that are behind the scenes that are only open to Administrators and Mods. And opinions and thoughts are discussed that no one else sees.
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Looks like hackles are raising up. There is no need for that. It's just a poll, for Pete's sake.
And for most of you that read this we admin and Mods have different views on some postings, so its a balance and mistakes are bound to happen. The Only thing I have done is caution on a couple of postings and notified the person by PM. I have Moved a posting from one location to another just as the new location was more appropriate.
So again just continue where you are and watch out for things that are, not for things that are not.
My comments are not the view of the forum but my own, and I have a right to express my concerns, just like any of you. Just because a question is raised shouldn't signal anyone there will be a change.
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If I were to make changes it would be discussed ahead of time. And I am by no means trying to conform to Allen's Forum. Oldsmobile started this forum and He stated certain goals. Nothing Has changed. But its dismal that radios don't take precedence. Why not Guys?
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Maybe we aught to make a rule for every posting one must be radio related just to get us going again. Is that right? of course not!

But please attempt to post something, please! about radio related subjects. If we don't we will go the same direction that 807 went.

[Resistance is Futile]

PS:
We have 3116 postings at this point in time and of those 1199 are clubhouse. Thats almost 38% of all postings!